Re: Is it just me, or has Oracle completely lost the plot?

Not so sure about university. Oracle products are used by enterprise. It is not usually who is 25 or 27 to decide to pay millions in licensing to oracle. Ok, you can find good jobs and it is true but the fact that a company buys or not oracle product is much more related to their business. There are cheaper or free technologies that in many case do their job well. Would you buy an exadata where you can use a normal postgresql on a common linux box ? IF you have already skilled employer and you have already oracle in the shop, probably you would buy oracle anywhere, but if you can avoid to afford the expense, a lot of customers take other directions . In my opinion the comparison with cars is not completely correct. People buy a ferrari for what they dreams , not because they need a ferrari. You can instead see oracle as a big expensive truck. You buy it because with your car you can not move the same weights. If you have to deliver a standard box, and you can do it with a common pickup, it is difficult that you buy a truck ...

Il giorno mar 25 ott 2022 alle ore 09:14 Jon Crisler <joncrisler_at_gmail.com> ha scritto:

> I think Oracle needs to pay more attention to the University / Education
> stream: If the Oracle tools are taught , then graduating students will
> tend to seek positions that use the same tools.
> My son went to one of the few Universities that offered courses in Oracle
> rdbms, sql and PL/SQL , and also Vmware. Add in Java and he had all
> the major parts of their tech stack right out of school.
> It was a good move because he got a very good paying job right out of
> school.
>
> On Tue, Oct 25, 2022 at 1:48 AM tefetufe <coskan_at_gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Continuing on car analogy
>> Having Flagship product Exadata Cloud at Customer is like having a
>> ferrari with a no-name body shop contract. I don't think Oracle executives
>> takes their ferraris to no name body shops but thats what they offer
>> nowadays.
>>
>> Support model of the flagship product is so wrong that owner start to
>> feel what is the use of ferrari.
>>
>> They have support and ops team model where support is just middleman
>> passing the ball.
>>
>> Ops team is massive bottleneck and dark hole.
>>
>> Whenever I see "engaged ops team" message I feel like I here we go 5
>> hours lost before I even get an answer.
>>
>> Paying that much money for this support doesnt make sense whatever the
>> json support or converged db they are trying to build.
>>
>> They also lost the mojo by being enterprise only.
>> Does any seasoned oracle person see a younster Oracle fan joining their
>> team ?
>> Those younsters drive the technology at companies and they are not even
>> offered free certifications or trainings. I don't even think Oracle show up
>> any university either. All they care is enterprise employees.
>>
>> They still trying to make money out of training and certification instead
>> of using it to make people learn to use.
>>
>> In my opinion If they bought Sony and playstation Instead of acquiring
>> zillion companies they could have a chance getting the hearts of young
>> generation. They have slim chance against amazon.com or microsoft xbox
>> with nothing attractive for youngsters to learn brand for them to stay as
>> major player.
>>
>> Changing red to black black to red again is not really making brand more
>> attractive
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Tue, 25 Oct 2022 at 08:14 Mladen Gogala <gogala.mladen_at_gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> On 10/23/22 18:15, Chris Taylor wrote:
>>>
>>> This is going to sound like old man / old technologist complaints, and
>>> it may be.
>>>
>>> But I am a technologist and the more I work with new versions of Oracle
>>> , the less and less satisfied I am with the new versions.
>>>
>>> Stuffing JSON, XML, CDC and whatever else into the database server *used
>>> to make sense* when the db server was the power house - when CPU, storage,
>>> network were expensive and your db server had all the horse power.
>>>
>>> Today is not that day. Today you can spin up a middle tier cluster with
>>> tons of CPU power, god awful network bandwidth and amazing storage.
>>>
>>> Since 12.1 I have spent more time with support and yelling at them to
>>> listen and to get an engineer on the call then all the years before (going
>>> back to 7.1).
>>>
>>> These ORA-01555 errors that come up with everything _besides_ actual
>>> rollback / undo space issues are incredibly incredibly annoying.
>>>
>>> It's no wonder people are leaving Oracle in DROVES - you have the
>>> licensing, you have the bugs and you have the support issues.
>>>
>>> Add to that Oracle stuffs their database product with so much stuff that
>>> no one uses, its no wonder people are leaving.
>>>
>>> I'm so fed up and looking forward to getting off Oracle and re-routing
>>> my career into something new (postgres, snowflake, dynamo db , anything
>>> besides Oracle and their issues).
>>>
>>> End of rant. Just wondering if I'm alone in this or not?
>>>
>>> Chris
>>>
>>> Well, let me play the devil's advocate and defend Oracle. Oracle still
>>> has the best technology, bar none. One important technology advantage over
>>> anybody else are global indexes. It is not possible to create a
>>> non-prefixed unique key over partitioned table in Postgres, MySQL or SQL
>>> Server.
>>>
>>> As for people leaving Oracle, it depends on the project. If a cheaper
>>> database is good enough, why pay for much more expensive Oracle? However,
>>> if your project includes high availability, text indexes, partitioning,
>>> encryption and the impeccable ability to recover as much data as possible,
>>> your only choice is Oracle. Oracle has by far the best technology.
>>>
>>> Oracle is going from the mass production model to the boutique model:
>>> making the expensive database for those who need it. Oracle RDBMS, until
>>> version 9, was Model-T: relatively cheap and sold en masse to everyone.
>>> That has stretched their support, brought a few lawsuits and presented some
>>> problems with doing business. Now, they want to be more like a Cadillac or
>>> Mercedes. Personally, I drive a Kia because that's all I need. Have I had
>>> special needs, like if running a limo service, I would have needed Cadillac
>>> or Mercedes cars. Relational database market is the same. It's flooded by
>>> low cost alternatives, which can get most of the jobs done. Oracle changed
>>> their business model and decided to go after the high end of the market. I
>>> hope it works for them. However, I did learn Postgres and I did help with
>>> converting one application from Oracle to PostgreSQL.
>>>
>>> Many people have switched. The world of PostgreSQL is full of former
>>> Oraclites like me, even some former Oracle Aces. It looks like Kevin
>>> Closson is not the only "Oracle Ace (ret.)" any more. For some unfathomable
>>> reason, people don't want to make their livelihood dependent on Oracle
>>> Corp. There is no reason to get angry about that. The only purpose of any
>>> corporation, including of course, Oracle Corp, is to make money for their
>>> shareholders. Unfortunately, I am not one of them. The mission of Oracle
>>> Corp is not to make computer geeks like you and me happy, their mission is
>>> to make money.
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Mladen Gogala
>>> Database Consultant
>>> Tel: (347) 321-1217https://dbwhisperer.wordpress.com
>>>
>>> --
>> --
>> Coskan GUNDOGAR
>>
>> Oracle DBA
>>
>> Email: coskan_at_gmail.com
>> Blog: http://coskan.wordpress.com
>> Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/coskan
>> Linkedin: http://uk.linkedin.com/in/coskan
>>
>

--
http://www.freelists.org/webpage/oracle-l