RE: job offer from SAUDI ARABIA

Brian,

Clearly the USA is not perfect, or the end point of social evolution on this planet (or others). The USA is the outcome of one set of highly successful (anglo-american) experiments/innovations with "freedom" and "commerce". American individualism is not particulary compatible with the other major world axiologies that are reflected in collectivist cultures.

That "success" doesn't exclude "good", "truth" or "beauty" as they have come to be experienced in other cultures.

Note that the whole idea of "freedom" is premised on the existence of the opposite, which is to say the universal reality of "slavery" as a social institution in every historical context experienced by "civilized" human beings for 5,000 years (including the significant reforms of slavery in Islam).

Historically, there has NEVER been a major culture free of slavery, or the deeply ingrained patterns of thought and experience left in slavery's wake.

Presumably at some (distant?) point in a more enlightened and just future, the individual conciousness and social insitutions (as expressions of individual conciousnes) will have evolved to reflect additional aspects of human potential, and will have largely transcended the shadows of the kinds of slavery/oppression that have characterized virtually all of humanity's "civilized" history.

For an interesting summary of the basic democratic principles of "civil society" and the relationship to the "information age", see the statement on the web site of the

     Computer Professionals for Social Responsibility (CPSR)
     working in the Internet Democracy Project

  http://www.cpsr.org/internetdemocracy/Statement_July-13.html

   excerpt:

   "...Civil society is a third sector of society alongside the state     and the market. The values underlying civil society include     freedom of association, freedom of expression, participatory     democracy, and respect for diversity. A vigorous civil society     is an important counter-balance to government and business. The     growing global integration of markets and coordination of     governments creates the need for a corresponding global civil     society.

    Technical coordination of the Internet’s core resources has     unavoidable social, economic, and political consequences. The At     Large elections present a welcome opportunity to achieve balance     on ICANN’s governing Board and to promote democratic governance of     Internet technical coordination. "
   ---

Given the massive erosion of *participatory values* that are required for the proper functioning of democratic capitalism, americans may not have the luxury of just resting on their venerable traditions much longer. Democracy is messy and inefficient, in other words, "high maintenance". Get lazy, and all sorts of sh*t starts hitting the fan.

regards,
ep

On 17 May 2001, at 12:17, Brian MacLean wrote:

Date sent:              Thu, 17 May 2001 12:17:18 -0800
To:                     Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <ORACLE-L_at_fatcity.com>

> God I live in an awful country. I'm sorry for all the tyranny my country
> has put the world through. I guess I'll just shoot myself.

...

--
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
--
Author: Eric D. Pierce
  INET: PierceED_at_csus.edu

Fat City Network Services    -- (858) 538-5051  FAX: (858) 538-5051
San Diego, California        -- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists
--------------------------------------------------------------------
To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message
to: ListGuru_at_fatcity.com (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in
the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L
(or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from).  You may
also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).