RE: Oracle Untested Infuriator

take a breath Steve!

-----Original Message-----
Sent: Thursday, May 22, 2003 12:07 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L

Or when you know the patch won't address the issue despite OWS' insistance so you argue with them about it and they don't give in so you humor them by going through the motions with the patch which may even entail some downtime and after going through this ordeal you eventually prove to them that this was a wild goose chase and ask them to really look into the problem this time after which they finally abandonned their kneejerk "upgrade to the next patch" response and eventually contact somebody who knows something about how the oracle works and gives you the "real" solution and you go through the motions again and "finally" fix the original problem only to find out a day later that the fix created two more tangentially related problems which you report to OWS so you can go through this wonderful fixing cycle again repeated two times over after which you try to maintain the pitch with damagement and your non-DBA collegues that Oracle really is the best database around knowing !
all along that you've been here before and probably will be here again someday in the future.

Fan of that little girl in the hotel with the run-on sentences... what's her name?
- Steve

-----Original Message-----
Sent: Thursday, May 22, 2003 9:12 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L

Ruth - And then what I love is when it turns out it wasn't the patch at all, but something different entirely!

Dennis Williams
DBA, 80%OCP, 100% DBA
Lifetouch, Inc.
dwilliams_at_lifetouch.com

-----Original Message-----
Sent: Thursday, May 22, 2003 9:53 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L

I love it when you think it is your stupidity so you try something 5 times, finally call Support, and they say "Oh, you found the xyz bug! You have to patch xyz to xyza." If it's a known bug, at least put a note on the disk, "don't use this until you have patched it" or something like that. A yellow sticky note would save hours of valuable time!!!

End rant,
Ruth
----- Original Message -----
To: "Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L" <ORACLE-L_at_fatcity.com> Sent: Tuesday, May 20, 2003 2:13 PM

> Hi Jeremiah,
>
> Now that was a RIGHTEOUS rant I can identify with! A glorious indignation
indeed. Don't you just want to stick your head out the window and shout: "I'm as mad a hell and I'm not taking it anymore!" ??
>
> Have you ever felt dumb confessing to an SA that, as a seasoned DBA you're
having difficulties installing the product? If so stand strong in the knowledge that it's not you who's dumb. Seasoned SA's will understand. Meanwhile damagement wonders why it takes so long to merely install software. Not very good PR Mr. Larry E. You only have one chance to make you're best first impression and you blew it right out the gate with this OUI crap.
>
> OK, I feel better... for now. :-)
>
> Steve Orr
> Bozeman, MT
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> Sent: Tuesday, May 20, 2003 11:27 AM
> To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
>
>
> Speaking of GUIs, lets hear it for the most horrendous GUI of them
> all, the nearly unusable Oracle Universal Installer.
>
> Although I avoid it religiously, opting to copy around tarballs
> instead, I still occasionally must run the installer on my master
> installation.
>
> Well, the master copy is in Seattle and I am in London. Why? because
> you have to have a dedicated host not running any instances for use as
> the master install location, due to the fact that the ORACLE_HOME is
> hardcoded into all sorts of files, and the thing refuses to run if
> there is an instance running, even if it isn't going to touch anything
> that instance is using. If you install in an alternate directory of
> one of your normal servers, you can never upgrade the thing.
>
> Although our WAN is fairly fast, it is no match for the OUI. You
> click a button, and 60 seconds later it visibly depresses. Then you
> wait for the results. Today I discovered that if you install 9.2 and
> patch it up to 9.2.0.3, you can't add components like JDBC drivers
> etc. from media without having the OUI automatically DOWNGRADE the
> Oracle Server binaries in the process. Sure you can copy them into
> place manually, but they won't get picked up in future upgrades with
> the... OUI!!
>
> Combine that with incorrect instructions, faulty readme files and just
> flat out non-QA'd software (oops forgot to make that file executable
> in the distribution!), and you get one frustrated DBA.
>
> All I can say is the OUI is the biggest piece of crap Oracle has ever
> produced (maybe I am forgetting Oracle Mail). I can't believe they
> haven't rearchitected it since its fateful inception and the demise of
> orainst. Who wouldn't give up a finger to have character mode orainst
> back?
>
> If I wrote a reliable character mode perl script that does the same
> thing as runInstaller, does anyone think I could sell it?
>
> The OUI has blown so much of my time this week. Companies should
> start asking Oracle for license fee discounts equal to the time their
> expensive DBAs flush down the toilet running the OUI and screwing with
> broken Oracle software (We have over 10 one-off patches on top of
> 9.2.0.3).
>
> I hereby declare that I will use all of my powers to get the present
> OUI scrapped in time for 10i. Stay tuned for updates.
>
> --
> Jeremiah Wilton
> http://www.speakeasy.net/~jwilton
>
> On Tue, 20 May 2003, Freeman Robert - IL wrote:
>
> > As for me and my house, we will choose manual migrations over GUI any
time.
> >
> >
> > Robert 12:23-24
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> > Sent: 5/20/2003 9:31 AM
> >
> > No problem, you are more than welcome and for your sarcasm, when you've
> > reached the point where you have done oracle work for 12 years(yes clear
> > back to BEFORE MIGRATION ASSISTANTS EXISTED), you can feel free to
> > verbally abuse me, in the mean time:
> >
> > BYTE ME.
> >
> > joe
> >
> >
> >
> > >Thanx a lot for your valuable info' JOE.
> > >
> > >Regards,
> > >Jp.
> >
> > 19-5-2003 12:27:52, Joe Testa <jtesta_at_dmc-it.com> wrote:
> >
> >
> > >>all migrations/upgrades are done manually, i've never trusted them
> >
> > dang
> >
> > >>gui tools
> > >>joe
> >
> > Joseph S Testa
> > Chief Technology Officer
> > Data Management Consulting
> > p: 614-791-9000
> > f: 614-791-9001
> > --
> > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net
> > --
> > Author: Joseph S Testa
> > INET: jtesta_at_dmc-it.com
> >
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> --
> Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net
> --
> Author: Jeremiah Wilton
> INET: jwilton_at_speakeasy.net
>
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Author: Ruth Gramolini
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