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FW: Apologies.....

From: Lisa Dobson <lisa.dobson_at_onenortheast.co.uk>
Date: Thu, 13 May 2004 18:01:36 +0100
Message-ID: <DC05A607D26ABD43AB37BED434B7C71B595B68@srv3920.onenortheast.net> 





Huge=20apologies=20to=20everyone=20for=20the=20'Outlook=20-yuck'=20formats=
=20of=20my=20previous=20messages.



Hadn't=20got=20round=20to=20changing=20any=20of=20the=20default=20settings=
=20on=20anything,=20but=20I'm=20now=20in=20plain=20text.
Hopefully=20it=20hasn't=20reduced=20too=20many=20of=20you=20to=20sending=20=
my=20mails=20straight=20to=20recycle=20bin.



Lisa.




-----Original=20Message-----


From:=20Lisa=20Dobson


Sent:=2013=20May=202004=2016:51


To:=20'oracle-l_at_freelists.org'


Subject:=20RE:=20Software=20vendor=20using=20additional=20schemas=20for=20=
testing!




Thanks=20Dick,=20and=20everybody=20else=20that=20replied.
I=20spoke=20to=20relevant=20people=20and=20they=20agreed=20to=20let=20me=20=
handle=20this.


Unfortunately,=20whilst=20in=20the=20meeting,=203rd=20party=20has=20dialle=
d=20in=20and=20begun=20setting=20up=20schemas.



As=20an=20example=20-



CREATE=20TABLESPACE=20"LIVE1DATA"=20LOGGING=20DATAFILE=20'E:\ORACLE\etc'=20=
SIZE=20700M=20REUSE=20AUTOEXTEND=20ON=20NEXT=20100M=20MAXSIZE=2032767M=20D=

EFAULT=20STORAGE=20(INITIAL=2064K=20NEXT=2064K=20MINEXTENTS=201=20MAXEXTEN=

TS=202147483645=20PCTINCREASE=200)



And=20he's=20created=2024=20of=20them!


I=20managed=20to=20get=20in=20touch=20with=20the=20guy=20to=20ask=20why=20=
defaults=20had=20been=20used=20and=20his=20comment=20was=20that=20most=20p=
laces=20they=20do=20work=20for=20don't=20have=20a=20dedicated=20DBA,=20and=
=20doing=20it=20this=20way=20is=20quicker.=20They=20monitor=20it=20and=20m=


ake=20any=20changes=20when=20the=20client=20calls=20in=20to=20report=20a=20=
problem.

Oh,=20and=20after=20reading=20Dick's=20mail,=20I=20checked=20out=20the=20u=
ser=20set=20up=20and=20permissions.
The=20users=20log=20in=20as=20the=20schema=20owner,=20but=20all=20of=20the=


=20schema=20owners=20have=20been=20granted=20the=20same=20role.=20And=20it=
=20would=20appear=20the=20grant=20all=20option=20has=20been=20used.
Methinks=20I=20have=20some=20clearing=20up=20to=20do!!



Lisa.





-----Original=20Message-----


From:=20Goulet,=20Dick=20[mailto:DGoulet_at_vicr.com]
Sent:=2013=20May=202004=2015:00


To:=20oracle-l_at_freelists.org


Subject:=20RE:=20Software=20vendor=20using=20additional=20schemas=20for=20=
testing!




Peter,



=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20Thanks=20for=20the=20reformat=20I=20was=20having=20=
problems=20reading=20the=20original=20=3D
message=20(Outlook,=20yuck).



Lisa,



=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20What=20I=20believe=20you=20need=20to=20do=20is=20g=
et=20damanagement=20to=20quantify=20what=20it=20=3D
would=20cost=20them=20when=20the=20production=20schema=20gets=20trashed.=20=
=20With=20all=20of=20=3D


that=20data=20running=20around=20in=20one=20instance=20on=20one=20computer=
=20that=20will=20=3D


happen,=20just=20a=20matter=20of=20time=20before=20someone=20logs=20onto=20=
the=20wrong=20schema.=20=3D


=20I'm=20also=20guessing=20that=20the=203rd=20party=20vendor=20did=20a=20"=

grant=20all=20on=20all=20to=20=3D
public"=20and/or=20passed=20out=20the=20production=20password=20like=20can=
dy,=20which=20is=20=3D
something=20that=20Sarbanes-Oaxley=20will=20NOT=20look=20nicely=20on.=20=20=
Some=20one=20may=20=3D




well=20get=20their=20hand=20slapped=20pretty=20hard=20since=20this=20is=20=
financials=20we're=20=3D


talking=20about.=20=20You=20also=20have=20the=20problem=20that=20activity=20=
in=20one=20schema=20=3D


directly=20impacts=20the=20production=20schema.=20=20Response=20time=20can=
=20get=20VERY=20=3D


slow,=20competition=20for=20rollback=20space=20is=20also=20a=20problem,=20=
bet=20they=20left=20=3D


only=20one=20rollback=20segment=20laying=20around=20in=20the=20system=20ta=
blespace.=20=20Did=20=3D


they=20configure=20a=20temp=20space=20or=20is=20that=20in=20system=20as=20=
well??=20=20Running=20=3D


system=20into=20the=20ground=20like=20that=20can=20cause=20the=20database=20=
to=20cease=20=3D


functioning=20with=20some=20really=20odd=20errors.=20=20What=20they=20shou=
ld=20have=20is=20=3D


production=20dedicated=20on=20one=20server=20with=20a=20second=20server=20=
doing=20all=20of=20=3D


this=20other=20stuff.=20=20If=20their=20absolutely=20bound=20to=20retainin=
g=20one=20server=20due=20=3D


to=20Oracle=20licensing=20issues,=20recommend=20a=20change=20in=20OS=20to=20=
Linux.=20=20For=20one=20=3D


it's=20cheaper,=20two=20it=20does=20not=20need=20as=20beefy=20a=20piece=20=
of=20hardware,=20and=20=3D


three=20you=20can=20more=20easily=20run=20multiple=20instances=20thereon=20=
so=20that=20at=20=3D


least=20production=20&=20the=20other=20stuff=20can=20be=20on=20separate=20=
instances=20which=20=3D


adds=20a=20nice=20layer=20of=20isolation=20from=20data=20corruption.



Dick=20Goulet


Senior=20Oracle=20DBA


Oracle=20Certified=208i=20DBA



-----Original=20Message-----


From:=20Robson,=20Peter=20[mailto:pgro_at_bgs.ac.uk]
Sent:=20Thursday,=20May=2013,=202004=205:21=20AM
To:=20oracle-l_at_freelists.org


Subject:=20RE:=20Software=20vendor=20using=20additional=20schemas=20for=20=
testing!




Management=20will=20not=20understand=20technical=20arguements=20in=20favou=
r=20of=20one=20=3D


strate=3D3D


gy=20or=20another.


You=20have=20to=20hit=20them=20with=20the=20issue=20of=20data=20quality,=20=
and=20integrity.=20The=20=3D
sys=3D3D
tem=20you=20describe=20seems=20to=20put=20these=20factors=20into=20questio=


n.=20Bring=20it=20down=20=3D


to=3D3D


=20money=20-=20a=20simplistic=20approach=20most=20management=20do=20unders=
tand.=20Consider=20=3D


the=20=3D3D


cost=20to=20the=20organisation=20of=20the=20database=20going=20pear-shaped=
.=20That's=20your=20=3D


bas=3D3D


e=20line.=20Then=20try=20and=20quantify=20the=20successive=20costs=20of=20=
each=20step=20towards=20=3D


you=3D3D


r=20perceived=20best=20system,=20with=20the=20financial=20costs=20of=20not=
=20doing=20that.=20=3D


Place=20=3D3D


a=20qualitative=20assessment=20of=20the=20vulnerablitiy=20of=20your=20pres=
ent=20system=20to=20=3D


col=3D3D


lapse=20(a=20%=20figure=20has=20impact).=20Ultimately,=20you=20have=20to=20=
make=20a=20=3D


cost-assessme=3D3D


nt=20of=20doing=20/=20not=20doing=20something.=3D3D20



Whatever=20else,=20management=20will=20be=20very=20aware=20that=20if=20the=
y=20ignore=20your=20=3D


advic=3D3D


e,=20and=20things=20go=20wrong,=20there=20will=20be=20a=20written=20docume=
nt=20from=20yourself=20=3D


havi=3D3D


ng=20warned=20of=20the=20situation,=20which=20would=20leave=20them=20very=20=
exposed.=20That=20=3D


can=20c=3D3D


oncentrate=20minds.



Ho=20Hum=20-=20it=20all=20seems=20incredibly=20elementary,=20but=20its=20n=
ot=20the=20first=20time=20=3D


I=20h=3D3D


ave=20encountered=20this=20sort=20of=20ostrich-like=20attitude=20to=20data=
base...



peter


edinburgh



>=20------------------

>=20Original=20message,=20formatting=20fixed

>=20-------------------

>=3D3D20

>=20OK=20guys,=20need=20some=20help=20and=20ammunition=20here,=20so=20a=20=

bit=20of=20background


>=20first.=20=20I'm=20in=20my=203rd=20week=20in=20a=20new=20job=20where=20=

they=20are=20have=20a=3D3D20


>=203rd=20party

>=20financials=20app=20sitting=20on=20=208.1.7=20on=20win2k.=20=20Software=

=20vendor=3D3D20


>=20is=20coming=20in

>=20today=20to=20make=20some=20changes.

>=3D3D20

>=20They've=20never=20had=20any=20in-house=20DBA=20skills=20and=20have=20r=

elied=3D3D20


>=20solely=20on=203rd

>=20parties.=20=20No=20Oracle=20support=20contract=20(I'm=20working=20on=20=

getting=20this


>=20changed!).=20No=20DBA=20contract=20with=203rd=20party,=20only=20charge=

able,=3D3D20


>=20ad-hoc=20work.

>=3D3D20

>=20So,=20they've=20talked=20about=20getting=20the=20data=20in=20the=20tes=

t/dev=20databases


>=20refreshed,=20far=20as=20I=20can=20see=20they=20only=20have=20one=20dat=

abase.=20=3D3D20


>=20Turns=20out=20they

>=20have=20one=20database=20with=20three=20separate=20schemas.=20To=20refr=

esh=20data,=203rd


>=20party=20has=20done=20export/import=20between=20the=20schemas.=20=20I'v=


e=20tried=3D3D20




>=20explaining

>=20that=20this=20is=20not=20ideal=20and=20that=3D3D3D20

>=20really=20they=20need=20a=20separate=20test=20system,=20but=20they=20do=

n't=20understand.


>=20Absolutely=20no=20database=20knowledge=20in=20here,=20and=20it=20would=


=20seem=20that=20even




>=20the=20software=20vendor=20is=20lacking=20in=20this=20department.=20(Ju=

st=20to=3D3D20


>=20demonstrate,

>=203=20redo=20log=20groups,=201=20member=20per=20group=20size=201M,=20all=

=20sat=20in=3D3D20


>=20same=20location,

>=202=20copies=20of=20controlfile,=20in=20same=20location=20-=20=20get=20t=

he=20drift??)


>=3D3D20

>=20The=20work=20the=20software=20vendor=20is=20coming=20in=20to=20do=20is=

=20create=206=3D3D20


>=20new=20schemas

>=20as=20a=20way=20of=20providing=206=20different=3D3D3D20

>=20'staging=20areas'=20where=20copies=20of=20the=20live=20data=20can=20be=

=20kept=20at=20different


>=20points=20in=20time=20to=20help=20through=20year=20end.=20Once=20year=20=

end=20is=3D3D20


>=20completed=20they

>=20think=20they=20can=20use=20these=20'staging=20areas'=20for=20testing=20=

enhancements.


>=3D3D20

>=20I=20can't=20look=20on=20Metalink,=20as=20no=20CSI=20number.=20=20I'm=20=

about=20to=20look=20at=20OTN


>=20and=20go=20RTFM's,=20which=20I=20only=20got=20today.

>=3D3D20

>=20What=20I=20would=20like,=20and=20quickly=20is=20some=20strong=20argume=

nts=20as=20to=20why=20it


>=20should=20not=20be=20done=20this=20way=20and=20alternatives=20to=20sugg=

est.=20I've=20already


>=20mentioned=20creating=20a=20dedicated=20test=20database.=20=20I've=20so=

=20far=20managed=20to


>=20hold=20off=20on=20the=20software=20vendor=20beginning=20work,=20but=20=

I=20now=20need=20to


>=20justify=20this=20to=20my=20manager=20and=20to=20the=20software=20vendo=

r.=3D3D3D20


>=3D3D20

>=20TIA


>=3D3D20

>=20Lisa.

>=20----------------------------------------------------------------

>=20Please=20see=20the=20official=20ORACLE-L=20FAQ:=20http://www.orafaq.co=

m


>=20----------------------------------------------------------------

>=20To=20unsubscribe=20send=20email=20to:=20=20oracle-l-request_at_freelists.=

org


>=20put=20'unsubscribe'=20in=20the=20subject=20line.

>=20--

>=20Archives=20are=20at=20http://www.freelists.org/archives/oracle-l/

>=20FAQ=20is=20at=20http://www.freelists.org/help/fom-serve/cache/1.html

>=20-----------------------------------------------------------------

>=3D3D20







This=20=20e-mail=20=20message,=20=20and=20=20any=20=20files=20=20transmitt=
ed=20=20with=20=20it,=20are


confidential=20=20and=20intended=20=20solely=20for=20the=20=20use=20of=20t=
he=20=20addressee.=20If


this=20message=20was=20not=20addressed=20to=20=20you,=20you=20have=20recei=
ved=20it=20in=20error


and=20any=20=20copying,=20=20distribution=20=20or=20=20other=20use=20=20of=
=20any=20part=20=20of=20it=20is


strictly=20prohibited.=20Any=20views=20or=20opinions=20presented=20are=20s=
olely=20those


of=20the=20sender=20and=20do=20not=20necessarily=20represent=20=20those=20=
of=20the=20British


Geological=20=20Survey.=20The=20=20security=20of=20e-mail=20=20communicati=
on=20=20cannot=20be


guaranteed=20and=20the=20BGS=20accepts=20no=20liability=20=20for=20claims=20=
arising=20as=20a

result=20of=20the=20use=20of=20this=20medium=20to=20=20transmit=20messages=
=20from=20or=20to=20the
BGS.=20.=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=20=


=20=20=20=20=20=20http://www.bgs.ac.uk







Please=20see=20the=20official=20ORACLE-L=20FAQ:=20http://www.orafaq.com




To=20unsubscribe=20send=20email=20to:=20=20oracle-l-request_at_freelists.org
put=20'unsubscribe'=20in=20the=20subject=20line.

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To=20unsubscribe=20send=20email=20to:=20=20oracle-l-request_at_freelists.org
put=20'unsubscribe'=20in=20the=20subject=20line.
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Archives=20are=20at=20http://www.freelists.org/archives/oracle-l/
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Confidentiality:=20=20This=20e-mail=20and=20its=20attachments=20are=20inte=
nded=20for=20the=20above=20named=20only=20and=20may=20be=20confidential.=20=
=20If=20they=20have=20come=20to=20you=20in=20error=20you=20must=20take=20n=
o=20action=20based=20on=20them,=20nor=20must=20you=20copy=20or=20show=20th=
em=20to=20anyone;=20please=20reply=20to=20this=20e-mail=20and=20highlight=20=
the=20error.

Security=20Warning:=20=20Please=20note=20that=20this=20e-mail=20has=20been=
=20created=20in=20the=20knowledge=20that=20Internet=20e-mail=20is=20not=20=
a=20100%=20secure=20communications=20medium.=20=20We=20advise=20that=20you=
=20understand=20and=20observe=20this=20lack=20of=20security=20when=20e-mai=
ling=20us.

Viruses:=20=20Although=20we=20have=20taken=20steps=20to=20ensure=20that=20=
this=20e-mail=20and=20attachments=20are=20free=20from=20any=20virus,=20we=20=
advise=20that=20in=20keeping=20with=20good=20computing=20practice=20the=20=
recipient=20should=20ensure=20they=20are=20actually=20virus=20free.
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Received on Thu May 13 2004 - 12:41:07 CDT












Original text of this message













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