RE: DBA - Job boundaries & perks

From: Mohan, Ross <MohanR_at_STARS-SMI.com>
Date: Fri, 22 Dec 2000 12:36:23 -0500
Message-Id: <10718.125262@fatcity.com>

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HiTech HiFashion segmented halide Xenon desk lamps...Herman Miller = Super
HiTech MaxAdjustable Chairs ( over $1500 each! ) ....personal CD player/radio....loft/window view of Chelsea, NYC...surrounded by compelling DBA Love Vixens and for you ladies, Stud Muffins on all sides....personal masseur...aromatherapy webcaching....shiatsu-based block buffering.....you name it, she's got = it.=20

-----Original Message-----
From: Loughmiller, Greg [mailto:greg.loughmiller_at_glenayre.com] Sent: Friday, December 22, 2000 10:56 AM To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L Subject: RE: DBA - Job boundaries & perks

I'm afraid to ask!?!?!?!?!?

Greg Loughmiller=20
Manager Database and Production Support-PrePaid=20 770.283.1744=20

=20

-----Original Message-----
Sent: Friday, December 22, 2000 9:52 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L

Also, Rachel has REALLY COOL office furnishings. :-)=20

-----Original Message-----=20
<mailto:carmichr_at_hotmail.com> ]=20

Sent: Friday, December 22, 2000 8:21 AM=20 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L=20

The CEO of the place I am now, just asked everyone in the company (less = than

100 of us) to send him an email with our top 10 "best and worst" things =

about our site and the company. And he MEANT it. He'll read them all, = and=20
will actually listen and try to make changes where possible.=20

At the staff meeting, when he handed out the bonus checks -- it was = like a=20
graduation. He called your name, you came up and shook his hand, got = the=20
check and EVERYONE applauded. We sang Happy Birthday to a couple of = people.=20

There is a LOT of work to do here. Long hours at times, work through = lunch,=20
work evenings and weekends at home. My junior DBA has to glare at me to = get=20
me away from my desk for a break. And I'm still barely running in place = to=20
keep up. And it gets frustrating at times (when I actually get 5 = minutes to=20
do my real work, and make an improvement I keep telling my boss "see = what I=20
can do when you let me do what I'm supposed to do?")=20

I, like Jeff, took a pay cut to come here. And I've had offers since = for a=20
LOT more money. But the attitude of the people here, when I can get = them=20
some information from the database that they can't find, or when I = speed=20
things up, well.... an email saying "thanks, you rule" is why I stay.=20

Tech is usually the "forgotten stepchild" of a company. No one knows = who you

are, what you do, and they only know your phone number to call and = complain.

Not here.... we do company outings, heck, we went bowling (and boy am I = a=20
lousy bowler -- and my teammates, kids half my age, just kept = encouraging me

and cheering me on). We know names and faces.=20

Sometimes the perks are not tangible.... and usually those are the = perks=20
that are really worth it. I have enough money to pay my bills and buy = myself

the occasional toy. More money won't make me happier. Being appreciated =

does.=20

Rachel=20

>From: paquette stephane <stephane_paquette_at_yahoo.com>=20
>Reply-To: ORACLE-L_at_fatcity.com=20
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <ORACLE-L_at_fatcity.com>=20
>Subject: RE: DBA - Job boundaries & perks=20
>Date: Fri, 22 Dec 2000 00:21:04 -0800=20
>=20
>I worked in a startup at my previous client, my best=20
>souvenir is wearing jeans at work.=20
>My worst souvenir is the times when the owner came in=20
>the IT room and asked the developpers to work in the=20
>production environment to be able to deliver on=20
>schedule.=20
>Since the startup was owned by a major corporation, no=20
>IPO so no future gold  :-(=20
>=20
>=20
>--- Jeffery Stevenson <jeff_at_mpv.com> a =E9crit : >=20
>Well, I'm working a startup job now and I really=20
> > like it.  I essentially=20
> > took a pay cut and the possibility of future "gold"=20
> > is always nice, but the=20
> > thing that convinced me to join this team was the=20
> > work environment.  A lot=20
> > more freedom to be creative and get work done...a=20
> > lot more input on the=20
> > architecture of the system (where they actually=20
> > listen and follow through on=20
> > the advice!), and a lot more fun in the work=20
> > environment (of course that=20
> > could be that its a good group of people I'm working=20
> > with).  The future is=20
> > really bright for this company, but even if they=20
> > fold tomorrow (extremely=20
> > doubtful), I'm having fun with my work and getting=20
> > an opportunity to learn=20
> > more, so it will have all been worthwhile.  At least=20
> > you have a lot of=20
> > long-term DoD contracts you can fall back on in your=20
> > area.  :)  BTW, Scott,=20
> > how's the modernization of that personnel data=20
> > system coming along?=20
> >=20
> > Jeffery Stevenson=20
> > Chief Databeast Tamer=20
> > Medical Present Value, Inc.=20
> > Austin, TX=20
> >=20
> > -----Original Message-----=20
> > [ mailto:Scott.Shafer_at_dcpds.cpms.osd.mil

<mailto:Scott.Shafer_at_dcpds.cpms.osd.mil> ]=20

> > Sent: Thursday, December 21, 2000 10:57 AM=20
> > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L=20
> >=20
> >=20
> > Bill, at least you're still employed.  I went after=20
> > the startup dream and=20
> > ended up with a pink slip when they folded up...=20
> > Not a fun time.=20
> >=20
> > --Scott Shafer=20
> >   San Antonio, TX=20
> >=20
> >=20
> > > -----Original Message-----=20
> > > From:     WIlliam Thater [SMTP:thaterw_at_telergy.net]=20
> > > Sent:     Thursday, December 21, 2000 6:26 AM=20
> > > To:       Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L=20
> > > Subject:  Re: DBA - Job boundaries & perks=20
> > >=20
> > > "O'Neill, Sean" wrote:=20
> > > >=20
> > > > How do you protect your "private life" time from=20
> > your role of DBA?.  Do=20
> > > you=20
> > > > have formalised detailed job contracts with your=20
> > employer covering such=20
> > >=20
> > > i'm supposed to have a private life?  damn, obody=20
> > told me.  why am i=20
> > > always the last one to know?  as for my contract,=20
> > i'm on call 24x7x365=20
> > > including holidays and vacations.  i hope you=20
> > don't work for a startup=20
> > > like me.  i won't do it again, i was sold on the=20
> > dream.  i was stupid.=20
> > >=20
> > > and the only perks are that i get everybody else's=20
> > cast of PCs and i get=20
> > > to do all my own tech support.=20
> > > --=20
> > > Bill Thater      Sr. ORACLE DBA=20
> > > Telergy, Inc     thaterw_at_telergy.net=20
> > >=20
> >=20
>----------------------------------------------------------------=20
> > > "Only two things are infinite, the universe and=20
> > human stupidity,=20
> > > and I'm not sure about the former."  -- Albert=20
> > Einstein=20
> > >=20
> >=20
>----------------------------------------------------------------=20
> > > --=20
> > > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ:=20
> > http://www.orafaq.com <http://www.orafaq.com> =20
> > > --=20
> > > Author: WIlliam Thater=20
> > >   INET: thaterw_at_telergy.net=20
> > >=20
> > > Fat City Network Services    -- (858) 538-5051=20
> > FAX: (858) 538-5051=20
> > > San Diego, California        -- Public Internet=20
> > access / Mailing Lists=20
> > >=20
> >=20
>--------------------------------------------------------------------=20
> > > To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an=20
> > E-Mail message=20
> > > to: ListGuru_at_fatcity.com (note EXACT spelling of=20
> > 'ListGuru') and in=20
> > > the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB=20
> > ORACLE-L=20
> > > (or the name of mailing list you want to be=20
> > removed from).  You may=20
> > > also send the HELP command for other information=20
> > (like subscribing).=20
> > --=20
> > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ:=20
> > http://www.orafaq.com <http://www.orafaq.com> =20
> > --=20
> > Author:=20
> >   INET: Scott.Shafer_at_dcpds.cpms.osd.mil=20
> >=20
> > Fat City Network Services    -- (858) 538-5051  FAX:=20
> > (858) 538-5051=20
> > San Diego, California        -- Public Internet=20
> > access / Mailing Lists=20
> >=20
>--------------------------------------------------------------------=20
> > To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an=20
> > E-Mail message=20
> > to: ListGuru_at_fatcity.com (note EXACT spelling of=20
> > 'ListGuru') and in=20
> > the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB=20
> > ORACLE-L=20
> > (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed=20
> > from).  You may=20
> > also send the HELP command for other information=20
> > (like subscribing).=20
> > --=20
> > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ:=20
> > http://www.orafaq.com <http://www.orafaq.com> =20
> > --=20
> > Author: Jeffery Stevenson=20
> >   INET: jeff_at_mpv.com=20
> >=20
> > Fat City Network Services    -- (858) 538-5051  FAX:=20
> > (858) 538-5051=20
> > San Diego, California        -- Public Internet=20
> > access / Mailing Lists=20
> >=20
>--------------------------------------------------------------------=20
> > To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an=20
> > E-Mail message=20
> > to: ListGuru_at_fatcity.com (note EXACT spelling of=20
> > 'ListGuru') and in=20
> > the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB=20
> > ORACLE-L=20
> > (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed=20
> > from).  You may=20
> > also send the HELP command for other information=20
> > (like subscribing).=20
>=20
>=20
>=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=20
>Stephane Paquette=20
>DBA Oracle=20
>stephane_paquette_at_yahoo.com=20
>=20
>__________________________________________________=20
>Do You Yahoo!?=20
>Yahoo! Shopping - Thousands of Stores. Millions of Products.=20
> http://shopping.yahoo.com/ <http://shopping.yahoo.com/> =20
>--=20
>Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com

<http://www.orafaq.com> =20

>--=20
>Author: =3D?iso-8859-1?q?paquette=3D20stephane?=3D=20
>   INET: stephane_paquette_at_yahoo.com=20
>=20
>Fat City Network Services    -- (858) 538-5051  FAX: (858) 538-5051=20
>San Diego, California        -- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists =

>--------------------------------------------------------------------=20
>To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message=20
>to: ListGuru_at_fatcity.com (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in=20
>the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L=20

>(or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may=20 >also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).=20

_________________________________________________________________=20

Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com
<http://explorer.msn.com> =20

--=20
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
<http://www.orafaq.com> =20

--=20
Author: Rachel Carmichael=20
INET: carmichr_at_hotmail.com=20

Fat City Network Services    -- (858) 538-5051  FAX: (858) 538-5051=20
San Diego, California        -- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists=20
--------------------------------------------------------------------=20

To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message=20 to: ListGuru_at_fatcity.com (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in=20 the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L=20 (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may=20 also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).=20

--=20
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com --=20
Author: Loughmiller, Greg
INET: greg.loughmiller_at_glenayre.com

Fat City Network Services    -- (858) 538-5051  FAX: (858) 538-5051
San Diego, California        -- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists
--------------------------------------------------------------------

To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: ListGuru_at_fatcity.com (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).

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HiTech HiFashion segmented halide Xenon desk =
lamps...Herman Miller Super HiTech MaxAdjustable Chairs ( over $1500 = each! )

....personal CD player/radio....loft/window view of =
Chelsea, NYC...surrounded by compelling DBA Love Vixens and for you = ladies, Stud Muffins on all sides....personal masseur...aromatherapy = webcaching....shiatsu-based block buffering.....you name it, she's got = it. 
 

-----Original Message-----
 From: Loughmiller, Greg [<A =
HREF=3D"mailto:greg.loughmiller_at_glenayre.com">mailto:greg.loughmiller_at_gl= enayre.com</A>]
 Sent: Friday, December 22, 2000 10:56 AM
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
 Subject: RE: DBA - Job boundaries & perks

 

I'm afraid to ask!?!?!?!?!?


Greg Loughmiller 
 Manager Database and Production Support-PrePaid =

 770.283.1744 


 


-----Original Message-----
 Sent: Friday, December 22, 2000 9:52 AM
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L

 
 

Also, Rachel has REALLY COOL office furnishings. :-) =



-----Original Message----- 
 <<A =

HREF=3D"mailto:carmichr_at_hotmail.com">mailto:carmichr_at_hotmail.com</A>>= ] 
 Sent: Friday, December 22, 2000 8:21 AM 
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L 

 

The CEO of the place I am now, just asked everyone in =
the company (less than


100 of us) to send him an email with our top 10 =
"best and worst" things 
 about our site and the company. And he MEANT it. =
He'll read them all, and 
 will actually listen and try to make changes where =
possible. 


At the staff meeting, when he handed out the bonus =
checks -- it was like a 
 graduation. He called your name, you came up and =
shook his hand, got the 
 check and EVERYONE applauded. We sang Happy Birthday =
to a couple of people. 


There is a LOT of work to do here. Long hours at =
times, work through lunch, 
 work evenings and weekends at home. My junior DBA =
has to glare at me to get 
 me away from my desk for a break. And I'm still =
barely running in place to 
 keep up. And it gets frustrating at times (when I =
actually get 5 minutes to 
 do my real work, and make an improvement I keep =
telling my boss "see what I 
 can do when you let me do what I'm supposed to =
do?") 


I, like Jeff, took a pay cut to come here. And I've =
had offers since for a 
 LOT more money. But the attitude of the people here, =
when I can get them 
 some information from the database that they can't =
find, or when I speed 
 things up, well.... an email saying "thanks, =
you rule" is why I stay. 


Tech is usually the "forgotten stepchild" =
of a company. No one knows who you


are, what you do, and they only know your phone =
number to call and complain.

 

Not here.... we do company outings, heck, we went =
bowling (and boy am I a 
 lousy bowler -- and my teammates, kids half my age, =
just kept encouraging me


and cheering me on).  We know names and faces. =



Sometimes the perks are not tangible.... and usually =
those are the perks 
 that are really worth it. I have enough money to pay =
my bills and buy myself


the occasional toy. More money won't make me happier. =
Being appreciated 
 does. 

 
 

Rachel 

 
 

>From: paquette stephane =
<stephane_paquette_at_yahoo.com> 
 >Reply-To: ORACLE-L_at_fatcity.com 
 >To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L =
<ORACLE-L_at_fatcity.com> 
 >Subject: RE: DBA - Job boundaries & perks =

 >Date: Fri, 22 Dec 2000 00:21:04 -0800 
 > 
 >I worked in a startup at my previous client, my =
best 
 >souvenir is wearing jeans at work. 
 >My worst souvenir is the times when the owner =
came in 
 >the IT room and asked the developpers to work in =
the 
 >production environment to be able to deliver on =

 >schedule. 
 >Since the startup was owned by a major =
corporation, no 
 >IPO so no future gold  :-( 
 > 
 > 
 >--- Jeffery Stevenson <jeff_at_mpv.com> a =
=E9crit : > 
 >Well, I'm working a startup job now and I really =

 > > like it.  I essentially 
 > > took a pay cut and the possibility of =

future &quot;gold&quot; </FONT>

 > > is always nice, but the 
 > > thing that convinced me to join this team =
was the 
 > > work environment.  A lot 
 > > more freedom to be creative and get work =
done...a 
 > > lot more input on the 
 > > architecture of the system (where they =
actually 
 > > listen and follow through on 
 > > the advice!), and a lot more fun in the =
work 
 > > environment (of course that 
 > > could be that its a good group of people =

I'm working </FONT>

 > > with).  The future is 
 > > really bright for this company, but even =
if they 
 > > fold tomorrow (extremely 
 > > doubtful), I'm having fun with my work and =
getting 
 > > an opportunity to learn 
 > > more, so it will have all been =
worthwhile.  At least 
 > > you have a lot of 
 > > long-term DoD contracts you can fall back =
on in your 
 > > area.  :)  BTW, Scott, 
 > > how's the modernization of that personnel =
data 
 > > system coming along? 
 > > 
 > > Jeffery Stevenson 
 > > Chief Databeast Tamer 
 > > Medical Present Value, Inc. 
 > > Austin, TX 
 > > 
 > > -----Original Message----- 
 > > [ <A =

HREF=3D"mailto:Scott.Shafer_at_dcpds.cpms.osd.mil">mailto:Scott.Shafer_at_dcpd= s.cpms.osd.mil</A>
 <<A =

HREF=3D"mailto:Scott.Shafer_at_dcpds.cpms.osd.mil">mailto:Scott.Shafer_at_dcpd= s.cpms.osd.mil</A>> ] 
 > > Sent: Thursday, December 21, 2000 10:57 AM =

 > > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L =

 > > 
 > > 
 > > Bill, at least you're still =
employed.  I went after 
 > > the startup dream and 
 > > ended up with a pink slip when they folded =
up... 
 > > Not a fun time. 
 > > 
 > > --Scott Shafer 
 > >   San Antonio, TX 
 > > 
 > > 
 > > > -----Original Message----- 
 > > > From:     WIlliam =
Thater [SMTP:thaterw_at_telergy.net] 
 > > > Sent:     =
Thursday, December 21, 2000 6:26 AM 
 > > > =

To:       Multiple recipients of list = ORACLE-L 
 > > > Subject:  Re: DBA - Job =
boundaries & perks 
 > > > 
 > > > "O'Neill, Sean" wrote: =

 > > > > 
 > > > > How do you protect your =
"private life" time from 
 > > your role of DBA?.  Do 
 > > > you 
 > > > > have formalised detailed job =
contracts with your 
 > > employer covering such 
 > > > 
 > > > i'm supposed to have a private =
life?  damn, obody 
 > > told me.  why am i 
 > > > always the last one to know?  as =
for my contract, 
 > > i'm on call 24x7x365 
 > > > including holidays and =
vacations.  i hope you 
 > > don't work for a startup 
 > > > like me.  i won't do it again, i =
was sold on the 
 > > dream.  i was stupid. 
 > > > 
 > > > and the only perks are that i get =
everybody else's 
 > > cast of PCs and i get 
 > > > to do all my own tech support. =

 > > > -- 
 > > > Bill =
Thater      Sr. ORACLE DBA 
 > > > Telergy, Inc     =
thaterw_at_telergy.net 
 > > > 
 > > 
 <FONT =

SIZE=3D2>&gt;-----------------------------------------------------------=

----- 
 > > > "Only two things are infinite, =
the universe and 
 > > human stupidity, 
 > > > and I'm not sure about the =
former."  -- Albert 
 > > Einstein 
 > > > 
 > > 
 <FONT =

SIZE=3D2>&gt;-----------------------------------------------------------=

----- 
 > > > -- 
 > > > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: =

 > > <A HREF=3D"http://www.orafaq.com" =
TARGET=3D"_blank">http://www.orafaq.com</A> <<A = HREF=3D"http://www.orafaq.com" =
TARGET=3D"_blank">http://www.orafaq.com</A>>  
 > > > -- 
 > > > Author: WIlliam Thater 
 > > >   INET: thaterw_at_telergy.net =

 > > > 
 > > > Fat City Network =
Services    -- (858) 538-5051 
 > > FAX: (858) 538-5051 
 > > > San Diego, =
California        -- Public Internet =

 > > access / Mailing Lists 
 > > > 
 > > 
 <FONT =

SIZE=3D2>&gt;-----------------------------------------------------------=

--------- 
 > > > To REMOVE yourself from this mailing =
list, send an 
 > > E-Mail message 
 > > > to: ListGuru_at_fatcity.com (note EXACT =

spelling of </FONT>

 > > 'ListGuru') and in 
 > > > the message BODY, include a line =
containing: UNSUB 
 > > ORACLE-L 
 > > > (or the name of mailing list you want =
to be 
 > > removed from).  You may 
 > > > also send the HELP command for other =

information </FONT>


<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>&gt; &gt; (like subscribing). </FONT>

 > > -- 
 > > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: =

 > > <A HREF=3D"http://www.orafaq.com" =
TARGET=3D"_blank">http://www.orafaq.com</A> <<A = HREF=3D"http://www.orafaq.com" =
TARGET=3D"_blank">http://www.orafaq.com</A>>  
 > > -- 
 > > Author: 
 > >   INET: =
Scott.Shafer_at_dcpds.cpms.osd.mil 
 > > 
 > > Fat City Network =
Services    -- (858) 538-5051  FAX: 
 > > (858) 538-5051 
 > > San Diego, =
California        -- Public Internet =

 > > access / Mailing Lists 
 > > 
 <FONT =

SIZE=3D2>&gt;-----------------------------------------------------------=

--------- 
 > > To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, =
send an 
 > > E-Mail message 
 > > to: ListGuru_at_fatcity.com (note EXACT =

spelling of </FONT>

 > > 'ListGuru') and in 
 > > the message BODY, include a line =
containing: UNSUB 
 > > ORACLE-L 
 > > (or the name of mailing list you want to =
be removed 
 > > from).  You may 
 > > also send the HELP command for other =

information </FONT>


<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>&gt; &gt; (like subscribing). </FONT>

 > > -- 
 > > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: =

 > > <A HREF=3D"http://www.orafaq.com" =
TARGET=3D"_blank">http://www.orafaq.com</A> <<A = HREF=3D"http://www.orafaq.com" =
TARGET=3D"_blank">http://www.orafaq.com</A>>  
 > > -- 
 > > Author: Jeffery Stevenson 
 > >   INET: jeff_at_mpv.com 
 > > 
 > > Fat City Network =
Services    -- (858) 538-5051  FAX: 
 > > (858) 538-5051 
 > > San Diego, California   &nbs=
p;    -- Public Internet 
 > > access / Mailing Lists 
 > > 
 <FONT =

SIZE=3D2>&gt;-----------------------------------------------------------=

spelling of </FONT>

information </FONT>


<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>&gt; &gt; (like subscribing). </FONT>

<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>&gt; </FONT>

<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>&gt; </FONT>

<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>&gt;=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D </FONT>

<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>&gt;Stephane Paquette </FONT>

<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>&gt;DBA Oracle </FONT>

<BR><FONT SIZE=3D2>&gt;stephane_paquette_at_yahoo.com </FONT>

 > 
 <FONT =

SIZE=3D2>&gt;__________________________________________________ </FONT>

 >Do You Yahoo!? 
 >Yahoo! Shopping - Thousands of Stores. Millions =
of Products. 
 > <A HREF=3D"http://shopping.yahoo.com/" =
TARGET=3D"_blank">http://shopping.yahoo.com/</A> <<A = HREF=3D"http://shopping.yahoo.com/" =
TARGET=3D"_blank">http://shopping.yahoo.com/</A>>  
 >-- 
 >Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: <A =
HREF=3D"http://www.orafaq.com" =

TARGET=3D"_blank">http://www.orafaq.com</A></FONT>

 <<A HREF=3D"http://www.orafaq.com" =
TARGET=3D"_blank">http://www.orafaq.com</A>>  
 >-- 
 >Author: =

=3D?iso-8859-1?q?paquette=3D20stephane?=3D 
 >   INET: stephane_paquette_at_yahoo.com =

 > 
 >Fat City Network Services    -- =
(858) 538-5051  FAX: (858) 538-5051 
 >San Diego, =

California        -- Public Internet = access / Mailing Lists 
 <FONT =

SIZE=3D2>&gt;-----------------------------------------------------------=

--------- 
 >To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send =
an E-Mail message 
 >to: ListGuru_at_fatcity.com (note EXACT spelling of =
'ListGuru') and in 
 >the message BODY, include a line containing: =
UNSUB ORACLE-L 
 >(or the name of mailing list you want to be =
removed from).  You may 
 >also send the HELP command for other information =
(like subscribing). 


<FONT =

SIZE=3D2>_______________________________________________________________=

__ 
 Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at <A =
HREF=3D"http://explorer.msn.com" =
TARGET=3D"_blank">http://explorer.msn.com</A>
 <<A HREF=3D"http://explorer.msn.com" =
TARGET=3D"_blank">http://explorer.msn.com</A>>  


-- 
 Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: <A =
HREF=3D"http://www.orafaq.com" =

TARGET=3D"_blank">http://www.orafaq.com</A></FONT>

 <<A HREF=3D"http://www.orafaq.com" =
TARGET=3D"_blank">http://www.orafaq.com</A>>  
 -- 
 Author: Rachel Carmichael 
   INET: carmichr_at_hotmail.com 


Fat City Network Services    -- (858) =
538-5051  FAX: (858) 538-5051 
 San Diego, =

California        -- Public Internet = access / Mailing Lists 
 <FONT =

SIZE=3D2>---------------------------------------------------------------=

----- 
 To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an =
E-Mail message 
 to: ListGuru_at_fatcity.com (note EXACT spelling of =
'ListGuru') and in 
 the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB =
ORACLE-L 
 (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed =
from).  You may 
 also send the HELP command for other information =
(like subscribing). 


-- 
 Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: <A =
HREF=3D"http://www.orafaq.com" =
TARGET=3D"_blank">http://www.orafaq.com</A>
 -- 
 Author: Loughmiller, Greg
   INET: greg.loughmiller_at_glenayre.com


Fat City Network Services    -- (858) =
Received on Fri Dec 22 2000 - 11:36:23 CST