| Oracle FAQ | Your Portal to the Oracle Knowledge Grid | |
 |
 | |||
| Oracle FAQ | Your Portal to the Oracle Knowledge Grid | |
|
| |||
Home -> Community -> Mailing Lists -> Oracle-L -> RE: OT RE: 24 x 7 on NT?
no, THEY look at the screen, while I type away
in any case, no matter what I do, they think it's easy. I think I do my job a little *too* well (kidding!)
>From: "Richard Ji" <rji_at_exenet.com>
>Reply-To: ORACLE-L_at_fatcity.com
>To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <ORACLE-L_at_fatcity.com>
>Subject: RE: OT RE: 24 x 7 on NT?
>Date: Wed, 27 Jun 2001 06:16:16 -0800
>
> >I think GUI tools are a great boon. If nothing else, it gives damagement
>a
> >pretty screen to look at while I am working on something else :)
>
>But isn't it better to let the damagement see me furiously typing at the
>keyboard? :-) If the damagement see you solved the problem by couple
>of clicks, he/she might think "hmmm, that was easy....".
>
>;)
>
>Richard Ji
>
> >From: "Mark Leith" <mark_at_cool-tools.co.uk>
> >Reply-To: ORACLE-L_at_fatcity.com
> >To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L <ORACLE-L_at_fatcity.com>
> >Subject: RE: OT RE: 24 x 7 on NT?
> >Date: Wed, 27 Jun 2001 02:55:28 -0800
> >
> >Oh I agree with what you are saying there - and that is EXACTLY why we
> >don't
> >deal with any tools that actually touch user data (unless you count
> >reorganizing tables/tablespaces etc..). And I'm not sure which tool you
>are
> >actually talking about, there are good and bad in the market place..
> >
> >I personally have a wealth of GUI tools available to me - SQL
> >Tuning/monitoring/management etc. and STILL revert to command line - as I
> >simply want to learn more.. BUT I would have to say that a GUI tool will
> >make a DBA more productive in their day to day work! There are few people
>I
> >know that can throw together a script that monitors X, then evaluate the
> >data that comes out of the a$$ end of it, in the time it takes to point
>and
> >click a button, and watch the lovely pretty graph that that GUI piece of
> >"junk" throws out for you..
> >
> >I have never been a DBA (although that is probably where my heart is),
>but
> >I
> >do know that you guys are on extremely tight schedules, with a LOT to fit
> >in
> >to a day, and if you can have a lovely GUI tool that sits in background
>for
> >you monitoring your database, and alert you when there IS a problem,
> >leaving
> >you to move on to more interesting stuff like tuning your database
> >parameters (in command line if you wish), eating your doughnuts, drinking
> >coffee, and slapping developers - what's the problem with them?
> >
> >Mark
> >
> >Disclaimer: This is in no way the view of my employer, just my own
> >(probably
> >stupid) opinion.
> >
> >-----Original Message-----
> >Dayal
> >Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2001 11:02
> >To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> >
> >
> > >>You know it make me laugh how a whole lot of people out there moan
> >about
> > >>point and click technology - YET the business that I am in - third
> >party GUI
> > >>tools for databases - is BOOMING! So what is it? DBA's don't like a
> >point &
> > >>click O/S - but one to help them with their job, is OK...
> >
> > >>Just my 50p :)
> >
> >But then I remember someone complaining of GUI'ed tool not doing right
> >Migration Job (after waiting for more than a day) for him right????
> >
> >And that's the reason, the more you become familiar with Depths of
> >Databases more you start hating those so called "Easy to Use GUI
> >Tools"...
> >
> >My 50p ;-))
> >
> >Rajesh
> >OC DBA 8&8i
> >-----Original Message-----
> >Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2001 1:32 PM
> >To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> >
> >
> >"I dont like to sit on my ass as others pass 3rd rate
> >information about a 3rd rate os on to others..."
> >
> >"The idea that Bill Gates has appeared like a knight in shining armor to
> >lead all customers out of a mire of technological chaos neatly ignores
> >the
> >fact that it was he who, by peddling second- rate technology, led them
> >into
> >it in the first place."
> >
> >Now I'm confused John - Is it a 2nd or 3rd rate O/S? :)
> >
> >By the way - that was the biggest damn paragraph I have seen in my life
> >-
> >you can't have written that on a Windoze box - it would have corrected
> >it
> >for you ! :)
> >
> >NOW - what about all those start-up companies that don't have oodles of
> >venture capital? Should they go out and purchase a Sun server at vast
> >expense compared to a few well set up Win2K boxes - and leave themselves
> >in
> >the shit with their bank balance? I Don't think so.. Can they still run
> >their business proactively, and continue to grow and make money? Sure
> >they
> >can.. Just because they don't have a UNIX box sitting in the middle of
> >their
> >small enterprise world - does not mean that their business is going to
> >fail?
> >If you ask me - old Bill has done the small business world a favour!! He
> >has
> >allowed the small business to run corporate applications and databases
> >on a
> >more affordable platform. Maybe it isn't as stable - and you may get
> >some
> >down time - but I'm sure a small business is NOT going to be loosing
> >?20,000
> >an hour because of system downtime.
> >
> >What a lot of you guys on here have to remember is that not every
> >company
> >has money printed for them, people have to START somewhere. The bottom
> >line
> >has already been stated - you CAN make an NT/2000 box stable enough to
> >run
> >*most* of the time - you just have to know how to wine, dine, and treat
> >it
> >well. If this is what you want to achieve, don't go installing new crap
> >on
> >your database server every week. LEAVE THE THING ALONE - and let it do
> >it's
> >job.
> >
> >You know it make me laugh how a whole lot of people out there moan about
> >point and click technology - YET the business that I am in - third party
> >GUI
> >tools for databases - is BOOMING! So what is it? DBA's don't like a
> >point &
> >click O/S - but one to help them with their job, is OK...
> >
> >Just my 50p :)
> >
> >Mark
> >
> >-----Original Message-----
> >Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2001 02:10
> >To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
> >
> >
> >Apparently you dont have any respect for the late Douglas Adams. Tisk
> >Tisk! I'm certianly not saying that NT isnt good for what it was
> >designed
> >to do... workstation/end user platforms. Its a nice way for everyone to
> >not have to think and enjoy pointing and clicking all day. Does windows
> >have the scalability/reliability needed in for a datawarehouse or heavy
> >transaction processing environment? Nope, but then again you probably
> >wouldnt know that cause its out side of the scope of windows :) I'm not
> >here to debate who is smarter than who, I just hate the environment that
> >windows breeds. I'm not a person person. I like to work with computers,
> >and when I have some twit crawling up my ass cause he thinks he knows
> >the
> >ins and outs of networking / data managment / io / resource management
> >cause he pointed and clicked his way into some certificate, it just
> >pisses
> >me off. If all you want to do is set up an exchange server at home fine,
> >but dont assume that you know EVERYTHING about smtp/mail servers/mua and
> >the universe because you pointed and clicked till your fingers were worn
> >down to the nubs setting up your backoffice suite of products 90% of
> >which
> >you will never use and 95% of the products that you actually do use, you
> >wont understand. Windows is a breeding ground for morons. IF (I
> >emphasize
> >IF) a knowledgeable individual sets up a windows machine, it can and
> >often
> >does what it says it can do. Windows doesnt breed and environment that
> >you
> >HAVE to learn what you're doing. Microsoft says that it wants everything
> >to be easy to set up and working together which when it happens its a
> >good
> >thing (although it happens few and far between). The problem is that
> >through years of never having to learn a thing you end up not knowing
> >anything. On a unix machine you HAVE to know what you're doing, what
> >you
> >need to set up and what its specific job is. I have to learn how the
> >parts
> >of the system work together, how the different systems interact, and how
> >everything fits into the whole. Because I know what everything is doing,
> >and how it behaves I can walk up to a windows machine and fix the
> >problem.
> >Windows is easy to use, easy to set up, and IS useful for the day to day
> >things of the average end user. When I walk into a data center at sun,
> >or
> >TI, or nokia, or ericson, or eds, or any fab plant I see rows and rows
> >of
> >sun / hp boxes doing a whole range of high availability services. When I
> >walk into broadwing or aperian or some other co-loc place that hosts a
> >bunch of .com's and see rows of way over priced/powered dell servers
> >hosting the 50 hits a day that averagestartup.com is getting then I
> >think
> >"fine... what has the world lost if that machine goes down? Do you think
> >that this place really was bright enough to hire a knowledgeable person
> >to
> >make the decisions in the first place. I mean come on they're whole
> >company plan is based around <insert crappy idea here>." Its not a
> >coincidence that there are rows of 6500/5500's and e10k's doing the
> >important work and slews of relatively cheap windows machines doing the
> >grunt labor that isnt what fuels the business... and its not cause sun
> >has
> >a great marketing/sales department either (most of those guys dont know
> >their head from their ass). The world is full of generalizations so
> >here's
> >mine: Windows is good for what it does. The average person doesnt have
> >to
> >learn much/anything to use it. It sucks at what it doesnt do, and it
> >doesnt do high availability. As for the quote, its not mine, I just
> >found
> >it amusing. I dont constantly complain about windows because I dont use
> >it, but then again, I dont like to sit on my ass as others pass 3rd rate
> >information about a 3rd rate os on to others... all that breeds is some
> >more 3rd rate people ;) All I'm doing is protecting my sanity/nerves by
> >having a few less morons out there, but as I can see its already too
> >late
> >for some :)
> >
> >Thanks,
> >jon
> >
> >
> >"The idea that Bill Gates has appeared like a knight in shining armor to
> >lead all customers out of a mire of technological chaos neatly ignores
> >the
> >fact that it was he who, by peddling second- rate technology, led them
> >into
> >it in the first place."
> >
> >-- Douglas Adams
> >
> >"If you have trouble sounding condescending, find a Unix user to show
> >you
> >how it's done."
> >
> >-- Scott Adams
> >
> >---trim---
> >
> >--
> >Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> >--
> >Author: Mark Leith
> > INET: mark_at_cool-tools.co.uk
> >
> >Fat City Network Services -- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051
> >San Diego, California -- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists
> >--------------------------------------------------------------------
> >To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message
> >to: ListGuru_at_fatcity.com (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in
> >the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L
> >(or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may
> >also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
> >--
> >Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> >--
> >Author: Rajesh Dayal
> > INET: Rajesh_at_ohitelecom.com
> >
> >Fat City Network Services -- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051
> >San Diego, California -- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists
> >--------------------------------------------------------------------
> >To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message
> >to: ListGuru_at_fatcity.com (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in
> >the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L
> >(or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may
> >also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
> >
> >--
> >Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
> >--
> >Author: Mark Leith
> > INET: mark_at_cool-tools.co.uk
> >
> >Fat City Network Services -- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051
> >San Diego, California -- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists
> >--------------------------------------------------------------------
> >To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message
> >to: ListGuru_at_fatcity.com (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in
> >the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L
> >(or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may
> >also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
>
>_________________________________________________________________
>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com
>
>--
>Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
>--
>Author: Rachel Carmichael
> INET: carmichr_at_hotmail.com
>
>Fat City Network Services -- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051
>San Diego, California -- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists
>--------------------------------------------------------------------
>To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message
>to: ListGuru_at_fatcity.com (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in
>the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L
>(or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may
>also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
>--
>Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
>--
>Author: Richard Ji
> INET: rji_at_exenet.com
>
>Fat City Network Services -- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051
>San Diego, California -- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists
>--------------------------------------------------------------------
>To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message
>to: ListGuru_at_fatcity.com (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in
>the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L
>(or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may
>also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
-- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Rachel Carmichael INET: carmichr_at_hotmail.com Fat City Network Services -- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California -- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists -------------------------------------------------------------------- To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: ListGuru_at_fatcity.com (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).Received on Wed Jun 27 2001 - 10:21:59 CDT
 |
 |